Episode 46 - Cornelius Fudge

Episode 46 – Cornelius Fudge: Traditional, Dependable, and Lime-Green

Join hosts Ev, Irvin, Sophia, and guest DJ (Denis James) as they discuss everyone’s favorite bowler hat-wearing Minister for Magic: Cornelius Fudge.

In this episode:

  • How much is Dumbledore to blame for Fudge’s Book 5 behavior?
  • Ev and Lucius Malfoy have something in common!
  • Voldemort clearly reads the Quibbler
  • Ministers we would rather have lunch with
  • Three flavors of Fudge

More from our guest, DJ:

The pub’s jukebox:

Posted in Characters, Episodes, Ev, Irvin, Sophia, Topics.
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AbsentMindedRavenD
AbsentMindedRaven
17 days ago

Sounds like Geoff and Irvin should get together on weekends and sell ice-cream.

Both Chamberlain and Churchill are more complex than they’re popularly remembered.

Chamberlain’s initial appeasement approach was widely supported at the time, because the UK was not ready to go to war. Churchill was a better wartime leader, but also a racist/colonialist in the “young Dumbledore” mould (i.e. “it is our responsibility to rule over these lesser peoples”).

It is strange that the ministry didn’t investigate the Third Task. Even dismissing Harry’s claims of Voldemort returning, a teen died. At a major public (international) event. They should have been trying to find out what happened.

Umbridge claims Cedric was a tragic accident, so why would Harry be telling this story? Even if Voldemort’s gone, his old followers, or a copy-cat, could be up to no good. So do the ministry believe Harry killed Cedric? Why aren’t they prosecuting him for that rather than manufacturing underage magic infringements? It makes me wonder at the authority of the Triwizard Tournament. Do champions get diplomatic immunity, and they fear the Goblet would enact retribution should anyone interfere?

I love the “Fudge working in secret” conspiracy-theory. Dumbledore would happily go along with being derided in the press: it strengthens the secrecy and unity of the Order, and it gets him out of the other jobs that take up his horcrux-hunting time.

Of course, Harry also gets slandered (even worse), but Dumbledore can shrug it off, surely a resilient young man should have no trouble. He’ll be fine. 10 points to Dumbledore. I’m so good at plans. etc. etc.

AbsentMindedRavenD
AbsentMindedRaven
16 days ago

With Dumbledore’s SOP, I fear that without the ticking clock of the wasting curse, he’d have taught Harry less about Voldemort and horcruxes (by the end of HBP, at least). He’s too good at putting off hard discussions.

Another reason Arthur was punished more for the car trip than the boys: it was meant to be invisible, but the booster conks out almost immediately. Unsurprising for something bodged together in the shed.

Fudge’s skillset seems to be interpersonal, which fits with Hufflepuff (as you noted, he seems very genial and avuncular). Great for winning an election, but not necessarily for getting stuff done as minister.

Given Hagrid’s anti-slytherin bias, he’d probably have been even more scathing had Fudge been a Slytherin.

But okay, types of Fudge:

  • Gryffindor = russian fudge
  • Slytherin = rum & raisin
  • Ravenclaw = peppermint swirl
  • Hufflepuff = chocolate
  • Malevolent = cinnamon spice
Irvin
Irvin
Editor
Reply to  AbsentMindedRaven
16 days ago

The types of Fudge are excellent!

Re: Dumbledore’s SOP, I’m with you 100%. I think Dumbledore would still have had the Horcruxes 101 curriculum for Harry, but it would have been intended to be acted upon after Harry left Hogwarts and was a fully trained wizard. There would have been much more emphasis on teaching Harry useful magic. Given Dumbledore would have tried to eliminate as many horcruxes as he could while alive, Harry’s role in his plan would be much more about him facing Voldemort and surviving, rather than taking care of horcruxes beforehand.

AbsentMindedRavenD
AbsentMindedRaven
Reply to  Irvin
16 days ago

Agreed. Though, hang on a minute…

If Dumbledore intends to destroy all the horcruxes himself, and it’s one of the things he keeps the most secret*, would he even tell Harry about them? Or just the limited information he told Snape? (“Harry, you’re suffering from voldebits. Take two avada kedavras and call me in the morning.”)

* It’s not entirely clear to me whether Dumbledore is secretive about horcruxes just to prevent Voldemort finding out Dumbledore’s onto him, or if he wants to let horcruxes (in general) be forgotten.

Irvin
Irvin
Editor
Reply to  AbsentMindedRaven
15 days ago

For why Dumbledore is secretive – it’s both. He wants horcruxes to be forgotten AND he wants Voldy to believe they already have been by everyone.

As for whether Dumbledore would tell Harry… I don’t think we can be certain. I would hope he’s learned enough by now that Harry needs to be clued in to some extent. But I think it leans more on how accepting Dumbledore is of his own mortality.

Independent of Dumbledore’s ticking clock or the Ringcrux curse, killing Dumbledore is now #1 on Voldemort’s to-do list, given that he assigns it to Draco before HBP begins. While Dumbledore would not plan on getting himself killed within the year, if he were wise, he would recognize the possibility that Voldemort would succeed eventually, and so would still work to prepare Harry to be the backup. Because, since we’ve established he wants as few people as possible knowing about horcruxes, if he’s going to have a backup Horcrux Hunter, the elegance of it being Harry doubtless appeals to him.

So I’d lean towards “yes, he’d still teach Harry about horcruxes at a leisurely pace.” But it’s a fair question, since if Dumbledore was feeling invincible, he really might not.

AbsentMindedRavenD
AbsentMindedRaven
Reply to  Irvin
14 days ago

I generally agree, but I’m not sure offing Dumbles is Voldy’s #1. Draco’s mission is 90% punishment, 10% “but, hey, if he manages it, cool”.

AbsentMindedRavenD
AbsentMindedRaven
16 days ago

Separate comment because it’s very much a tangent.

I’d always had the impression that after a Dementor’s Kiss a body is left basically comatose; only doing autonomous actions, so still breathing but unlikely to live very long.

Which leads me to two possible avenues for fanfic writers:

  1. One-way soul/memories time-travel redo fics were/are a popular subgenre; what if rather than merging with one’s past self, the time traveller instead turns up at the end of GoF and takes over this conveniently-vacant body?
  2. Maybe the Resurrection Stone was intended to restore victims of the Dementor’s Kiss, hence it can only bring back a ghost-like essence of the person. Without a body to inhabit, the shade only remains until the caster cancels the spell.
Irvin
Irvin
Editor
Reply to  AbsentMindedRaven
16 days ago

I like it!

I also wonder, would a Kissed body be a handy receptacle for a bit of soul? Could it be a horcrux? There’s no other competing soul in it, so it seems ripe for possession!

AbsentMindedRavenD
AbsentMindedRaven
Reply to  Irvin
16 days ago

I didn’t even think about that aspect. I guess there’s a reason I’m not a horror writer!

TheWeaponWeHaveIsLove
TheWeaponWeHaveIsLove
Guest
Reply to  AbsentMindedRaven
10 days ago

So I keep meaning to look up any supporting sources for this (and I swear one day I will), but my take on what happens with a person who is kissed is basically someone who is alive and capable of basic functions (i.e. not comatose) but everything that makes them them is gone. So post-dementor kiss people ending up not living very long because there’s not point (a bit like after stilling in Wheel of Time series).

NoNeedtoCallMeSirProfessorD
NoNeedtoCallMeSirProfessor
13 days ago

Thanks again for having me on! It was great fun!